January 2021 McDougall MWL Weigh-In Group

[Drew*]

Weight change +/- in lbs: -3.1 lbs. (181.5 lbs., 26.62 BMI, 1/22/2021)

MWL checklist

1. Start each meal with a soup and/or salad and/or fruit. 90% - mostly soup or fruit, last night due to my ongoing health issue I deviated a bit
2. Follow the 50/50 plate method for your meals, filling half your plate (by visual volume) with non-starchy vegetables and 50% (by visual volume) with minimally processed starches. Choose fruit for dessert. 65% - I am balancing my doctor's orders right now and finding that for the most part I have complied.
3. Greatly reduce or eliminate added sugars and added salts. This includes gourmet sugars and salts, too. If either is troublesome for you, you can eliminate them. 50% as some of my food had a little salt
4. Eliminate all animal foods (dairy, meat, eggs, fish, seafood). 100%
5. Eliminate all higher fat plant foods (i.e., nuts, seeds, avocados, tofu, soy). 90%. Exception: low fat miso soup with 3-4 small pieces of tofu
6. Eliminate any added oil. 100%
7. Eliminate all higher calorie-dense foods including flour products (i.e., bread, bagels, muffins, crackers, dry cereals, cookies, cakes), puffed cereals, air-popped popcorn and dried fruit. 50%. It is difficult at times to comply, but I needed something late last night and had some saltines that fit-in with my health issue
8. Don't drink your calories (especially from juices & sugar-sweetened beverages). 100%
9. Follow these principles, eating whenever you are hungry until you are comfortably full. Don't starve yourself and don't stuff yourself. 75%. Ate too much on Thursday afternoon...not good for health and disposition later in the day
10. Avoid being sedentary and aim for at least 30 minutes or more of moderate exercise daily (i.e., brisk walking). 60%. 4 X this week due to disposition. May get on mini-stepper later today.
Victories, comments, concerns, questions:

I am still dealing with a health issue that is diagnosed several different ways, so I am getting some clarity about it Monday morning, I hope. The plan is MWL with an emphasis on bland foods that are lower in acid per doctor's advice.

The non-GPS fitness tracker came and it is helpful to better track my walking and exercise. I am considering adding walking for exercise as well. I can sync the app with Google Fit. It is not 100% accurate, but close.

Thank you all!

Drew*

[Growing a Pear]

Weight change +/- in lbs: -0.5#

1. Start each meal with a soup and/or salad and/or fruit.
2. Follow the 50/50 plate method for your meals. Choose fruit for dessert.
3. Greatly reduce or eliminate added sugars and added salts. This includes gourmet sugars and salts, too. If either is troublesome for you, you can eliminate them.
4. Eliminate all animal foods (dairy, meat, eggs, fish, seafood).
5. Eliminate all higher fat plant foods (i.e., nuts, seeds, avocados, tofu, soy).
6. Eliminate any added oil.
7. Eliminate all higher calorie-dense foods including flour products.
8. Don't drink your calories (especially from juices & sugar-sweetened beverages).
9. Follow these principles, eating whenever you are hungry until you are comfortably full.
10. Avoid being sedentary and aim for at least 30 minutes or more of moderate exercise daily (i.e., brisk walking).

A better week. The breadbox arrived four days ago. I do think it makes a difference. I haven't dipped into it once since it vanished from sight. No Clif Bars. No other rich foods, really. I've gone starch-heavy to get myself out of the pleasure trap but should be able to do better at #2 this week now I've almost got myself free.

Have struggled with exercise. I think it's the arrival of deep, dark winter, plus all evidence I won't be eligible for the vaccine until late fall. But! I will endeavor to do better with my movement. When I do, everything feels easier.

So the 50:50 plate and exercise will be my focus this week.

[Noella]

Dear Mark, Wildgoose, and Jeff, and all MWL participants,

+/- 0 pounds No change in my weight again this week.



1. Yes, I started each meal with a soup and/or salad and/or fruit.
2. Yes, I followed the 50/50 plate method for your meals, filling half your plate (by visual volume) with non-starchy vegetables and 50% (by visual volume) with minimally processed starches. Choose fruit for dessert.
3. Yes, I greatly reduced or eliminated added sugars and added salts. This includes gourmet sugars and salts, too.
4. Yes, I eliminated all animal foods (dairy, meat, eggs, fish, seafood).
5. Yes I eliminated all higher fat plant foods (i.e., nuts, seeds, avocados, tofu, soy).
6. Yes, I eliminated any added oil.
7. Yes, I eliminated all higher calorie-dense foods including flour products, puffed cereals, air-popped popcorn and dried fruit.
8. Yes, I didnt drink calories (especially from juices & sugar-sweetened beverages).
9. Yes, I followed these principles, eating whenever hungry until comfortably full. I didn’t starve or stuff.
10. I want to, but, I can’t do any exercise at the moment. I have a chest wall contusion from my fall. I’m pretty sad about that because I REALLY want to exercise. Apparently it will take six-twelve weeks to heal.

Best regards,
Noella

[Mark Cooper]

The window for reporting this week's weigh-in and behavioral results has officially closed.

The remainder of my replies and the weekly summary will follow.

[Growing a Pear]

Re: the discussion about clearing the countertops of all food except fruit. I agree that helps and I have found that I had to go one step further: I realized that any food that is placed at eye level in a cupboard or a fridge eventually presents a real problem for me. So I put the peanut butter and tahini at the back of the shelf where it doesn't attract my eye every time I open the cupboard. Same with bread and nuts. Visual cues set my brain up for a slip.
Carol

I do this too, carwex. Rich foods go in opaque containers set behind other objects, compliant foods in clear containers readily visible. To a large extent, this is habit for me now. I had just never solved the issue WRT bread.

[Mark Cooper]

deb102 - Great progress with your exercise regimen! Feeling good is the best reward, right? Given that it felt quite difficult to adhere to the recommendations this week, was anything different vs. the previous week? Any changes to your environment, preparation or routine? I love both brown basmati rice and potatoes, steamed, baked or mashed.

chrisg - I think it is natural to feel frustrated when our progress stalls, or when the results we're seeking appear to be out of reach. Try not to despair; adherence over time delivers results. On the occasions when you decided to eat some bread or the non adherent restaurant meal, what was your decision making process? Can you think of anything in particular that sent you down that path? Was anything different from the other 18 times when you chose adherent foods? Are there things you can do or change to make it feel easier to adhere more strictly to the recommended pattern of behavior?

cmcavazos - Six days of solid adherence proves you can make this work, Christine! It is just a matter of adjusting your routine and making preparations for the next "off day," so that obstacles can be circumvented, challenges more easily overcome, and setbacks avoided. Your reflection on that "off day" provides some insight; what things could you do to make your routine more resilient?

josietheschnauzer - Big drop this week, Elsa! Congratulations on hitting that September low! I'm happy you were able to find inspiration in those articles to "keep on truckin" for the long haul.

jnc - Down another 1.4 lbs! How great is it to have some of the recommended behaviors feeling easy and effortless, right? Preparation and planning is almost always a winning practice. Having a good, strong, motivating "why" in mind could definitely help balance the impulse for immediate gratification; it might also help to get the most tempting things out of sight and out of reach (if you can't get them out of the house entirely). Keep at it!

chef16 - Sorry you are feeling so much stress, Doreen! Do you have any tools or practices for managing stress that have helped in the past? Jeff's short and funny meditation video might offer an idea worth trying. Can you think of anything you might do to prepare so that you can stick to the recommended behaviors, even when under significant stress?

Gimmelean - That Pleasure Trap trifecta is a real 800-pound gorilla, right? You sound well-prepared to face the challenge of clawing your way out of that trap; you are right that it may feel like a very arduous climb, especially at first. Dr. Lisle's lecture discussing the Cram Circuit may offer some additional insight; ultimately, I believe he says we have to "white knuckle it" for a while to break that conditioning. I look forward to your future smugness!

Ejg - Hang in there, Eric! If the main issue is added salt, that is relatively easy to correct, right? The vast majority of commercially prepared salsas are quite high in salt; you can check store-bought items against Jeff's Rules & Guidelines for Reading Labels to get a sense of whether a particular product is acceptable. Seems like you had a good week, otherwise. Getting the food right tends to have a more sizable effect on the scale than variations in exercise, so exercise "justifying" various exceptions could be a bit of a double whammy, I would think.

oneesotericgirl - Down 2.6 lbs! I'm so glad you are feeling proud about the changes you have made, and that you are noticing progress toward further changes and closer adherence. I'm glad you enjoyed that dressing!

Better planning for unexpected food availability issues

This is really important; it is one of the key things we can do to really support success, in my opinion.

I am being kind and forgiving to myself for any time I am not perfect, because it is about learning how to live a healthier life over anything else.

Good for you! Also important. Keep moving toward greater adherence, aiming for steady, attainable progress from day to day and week to week.

UncleMike - Nearly 3 pounds gone! It looks like you did really excellent work adhering to the guidelines for your meals! Would building a daily walk into your regular schedule, with time earmarked for that, help make that goal feel more manageable? Keep up your impressive efforts!

JaBee - Looks like you made the most of this week with all those 7/7s! If salt feels like something to which you are particularly sensitive, eliminating it definitely makes sense. Flaxseed, being a seed, is a higher fat plant food, so the recommendation for MWL is to eliminate it.

Eliminate all higher fat plant foods (i.e., nuts, seeds, avocados, tofu, soy).

Carry on with the awesome momentum you established this week!

Drew* - Nice loss! MWL with mild foods seems to be working for you. Hopefully, Monday morning you'll receive clarifying, comforting and encouraging information; I wish you the best possible outcome. Keep doing your best and enjoy putting that fitness tracker to good use.

Growing a Pear - Awesome! I'm so glad your experiment using the breadbox is proving fruitful. I know what you mean about the deep, dark winter arriving, but as you say, daily exercise tends to make "everything feel easier."

So the 50:50 plate and exercise will be my focus this week.

Noella - 9 big YESes are worthy of pride, especially under the circumstances! I know from personal experience how unpleasant and debilitating that injury can be. Take care and just do your best; I'm wishing you an easy and full recovery.

[Mark Cooper]

Please note - I replied to each participant individually in the two lengthy posts linked below, provided that their reports followed the guidelines for weigh-ins.

Mark's Replies for January 22 - Part 1
Mark's Replies for January 22 - Part 2

By my count, 28 participants reported for our fourth January 2021 MWL weigh-in! If I neglected to include anyone, or you notice an error in the tally, please let me know (via PM so we can keep the thread as tidy as possible, or in a post here if you cannot PM).

Here are the results for the fourth Friday in January:

Week ending 1/22/2021: 28 participants reported a total loss of -26.30 pounds
--------------------------------------------------
Ejg +2.40
Deb102 +2.20
Gimmelean +1.60
Squealcat +1.60
birdy birdy +1.20
Chrisg +0.40
--------------------------------------------------
Total gains: +9.40
--------------------------------------------------
NO CHANGE / MAINTAIN / STARTING OUT
Chef16 0.00
CindyD 0.00
Hope410 0.00
Noella 0.00
--------------------------------------------------
Cmcavazos -0.20
GreenFroG -0.20
Growing a Pear -0.50
PonysPlants -0.60
Jan_npr -1.30
Jnc -1.40
Rebecka22 -1.60
Brookelikesrunning -2.00
Jkcook -2.00
JaBee -2.10
Wstokes -2.40
Oneesotericgirl -2.60
Sunshine-oats -2.80
UncleMike -2.90
HoustonJason -3.00
Josietheschnauzer -3.00
Drew* -3.10
Rita<3 -4.00
--------------------------------------------------
Total losses: -35.70
--------------------------------------------------
Cumulative group loss for January 2021 to date: 98.50 pounds
Average loss for week ending January 22: 0.94 pounds
--------------------------------------------------

Next Weigh-In is on Friday, January 29, 2021.


Cheers for all the efforts on display in this week's reports! Keep putting in the work each day and week and you are bound to succeed!

With this week's remarks, I want to encourage you to consider adopting a perspective toward the MWL 10-Point Checklist that I think has significant potential value in supporting your progress: consider each point on the list as a binary, either or proposition; either you ate higher fat foods, or you didn't, you drank your calories or you didn't, &c. That isn't to say that you should expect yourself to be perfect (nor do we expect that). Making these changes in behavior is extremely challenging, so treat yourself with compassion when your efforts fall short. But, be thorough in your assessments and try to make an honest self-appraisal of whether you are adhering to or deviating from a given point. It can, I think, be very difficult to have an accurate idea of what "80%" omitting a particular food actually means with respect to one's progress - even just in your own mind as you assess how things are going. To me, this seems to go hand in hand with the natural tendency toward

Minimizing/Rationalizing the effect of certain behaviors and/or personal preferences, **especially in regard to certain foods**.

As Jeff lays out so clearly in The Myth of Moderation Pt 3: Is Your Diet Exceptional?, certain choices that we might think make little difference can have an outsized effect in contributing to the quality of our overall dietary pattern.

So, let's look at the impact of few items that are often considered as exceptions and what would happen if you added in just a few of these.

- A tbsp of oil is ~120 calories

- A tbsp of sugar is ~50 calories

- An ounce of chocolate is ~150 calories

- A 5 oz glass of wine is ~120 calories

- A serving of a refined grain is ~80-100 calories

- A small piece of vegan pie, cake or a cookie can easily be 100-150 calories (or more).

The total of the above is over 620-690 calories which would be over 1/3 of an 1800 calorie diet, over 1/4 of a 2400 calorie diet. And that is for just one serving of each. If you have 2 servings of each, you are around 1300 calories which is over 2/3's of an 1800 calorie diet and over 1/2 of a 2400 calorie diet.

As you can see, it is very easy for these exceptions to add up. And, if you add in a few more of these "exceptions," the exceptions have become the rule, and the healthy foods have become the exception and while you may have an exceptional diet, it is not healthy.

I think for many of us, taking an "either or not" approach to the checklist assessment can really help to bring appropriate attention to "exceptions" and put us on the path toward eliminating them.

I do also want to underscore that the MWL guidelines are just that, guidelines, not absolute commandments. Jeff has discussed this, as well.

The MWL guidelines are guidelines, not black and white rules and are based on the principles of calorie density, satiety, fiber/kcal, food form, chewing, etc. etc. The more you do, the more you can benefit.

Starting meals with a soup, salad and/or fruit, helps to lower the overall calorie density of the meal and increase the overall satiety. This helps to decrease the overall caloric intake without giving up any weight or volume of food, which usually increase. Hence the saying, eat more, weigh less. Eat more food in volume/weight while eating less calories. Some will start with huge salads and/or soups, some will have small ones. Some have both, some have none. It is a guideline but all based on the science of pre-loading. Fruit is included because it works better for breakfast for many. However, many people like “savory” breakfast and have oatmeal with vegetables.

While using these as a pre-load work, they also work as part of the meal (50/50 plate) which is based on the science of dilution.Some may end up needing to do both to hit their goals, same may need to do one or the other.

Fruit for dessert is also a guideline not a rule. Dessert is not served everyday at the 10-Day, and when it is, it is fruit. The limit of 2 servings of fruit is based on Dr McDougall’s personal experience and, like the limit on beans, is just a weekly average. His main concern with fruit in regard to weight is that he says he sees participants “binging” on fruit.

For the record, there is also unlimited fruit (and unlimited McDougal bean soups) served at the 10-Day program in the snack room for the participants to choose from.

I wrote something similar over a year ago.

When making use of the MWL 10-Point Checklist, please keep in mind that the 10 points are guidelines that highlight areas on which to focus when you are struggling, or not seeing the results you would like. They are not absolute commandments. One example - you aren’t obligated to begin every meal with a salad, but if you find that you are having problems maintaining satiety, starting a meal with salad or soup can be very helpful. The same reasoning holds true for dessert; you don’t have to eat dessert if you are not hungry, but if you do want dessert - choose fruit. Also note that the Checklist recommends limiting added salt and sugar, but this is not a salt-free or sugar-free program. We recommend food be prepared without added salt or sugar, but it is acceptable to sprinkle a modest amount of salt or sugar on the surface of your food at the table. At the same time, if salt or sugar are a problem for you, it is perfectly acceptable to eliminate them completely (but is not required). Please remember that ultimately we are trying to establish healthy habits that can be maintained over the long term.

That viewpoint may seem to directly contradict what I just wrote about the checklist above, but considered in perspective I think the two concepts are actually complementary. The guidelines, taken in a binary, pass/fail fashion, serve to direct the focus of our efforts, especially when we're struggling to achieve the results we seek. They aren't black and white requirements, but they tell us exactly the things we have the opportunity to do for improving our results. Some of us, to get where we want to be, will need to be more attentive than others - as Jeff points out

Some will start with huge salads and/or soups, some will have small ones. Some have both, some have none . . . While using these as a pre-load work, they also work as part of the meal (50/50 plate) which is based on the science of dilution. Some may end up needing to do both to hit their goals, some may need to do one or the other.

Take a look at how you are doing and the results you're seeing, perform an honest and thorough appraisal of the guidelines and make the recommended adjustments as needed.

My best to each of you! Take care, be well, and have an outstanding week!

[carwex]

Starting weight=136
Last week=134
This week=133
Loss this week= 1 pound

1. Start each meal with a soup or salad. I have soup ready 90% of the time/if not- a salad
2. Follow the 50/50 plate method, ½ starch and ½ vegetables. Yes
3. Greatly reduce or eliminate added sugars and salts. Reduced yes, eliminated no
4. Eliminate all animal foods. Tasted some fish and cheese.
5. Eliminate all higher fat plant foods. Miso and tofu are still part of some soup during the week
6. Eliminate any added oil. Yes
7. Eliminate all higher calorie dense foods. Trying to cut flax
8. Don’t drink your calories. I managed to have water rather than be tempted to drink plant milk
9. Follow these principles whenever you are hungry until you are comfortably full. Yes. If I’m hungry between meals, I take an additional small meal like a small potato and a veg.
10. Avoid being sedentary. Yes.This week I swam and exercised

Victories, comments, concerns, questions: I was happy to lose a pound this week.Middle of the week was not good but I got back on the program as written and it worked out well.
I have been working on not taking extra tastes (of either compliant or non compliant foods) while standing and preparing meals. The compulsive need to have something in my mouth baffles me but is ever present. It’s especially bad when I have to entertain or even feed even one extra person. I believe that without this habit I would have no problem with weight ever. It is worthwhile attending to it.
The warm weather is here so we are getting out a lot and that means moving which is always good for an older body.
I was fortunate to find a Vietnamese restaurant which has a near perfectly compliant dish of a veg soup with rice noodles. Hope the rice noodles are compliant. It is almost impossible to get compliant dishes eating out so we mainly eat at home. We save a lot of money and a lot of health.
Question: why is a tablespoon of flax a day not recommended on this program. It's hard to believe that it would turn anyone on like sugar or salt or fat. Yes it is a high fat item but in such small quantities can it be bad for us? I feel that it adds some essential fat to my diet and may be important at my advanced age.

Thanks for all the feedback and the wonderful service that everyone gives on this discussion. Carol

[oneesotericgirl]

With this week's remarks, I want to encourage you to consider adopting a perspective toward the MWL 10-Point Checklist that I think has significant potential value in supporting your progress: consider each point on the list as a binary, either or proposition; either you ate higher fat foods, or you didn't, you drank your calories or you didn't, &c. That isn't to say that you should expect yourself to be perfect (nor do we expect that). Making these changes in behavior is extremely challenging, so treat yourself with compassion when your efforts fall short. But, be thorough in your assessments and try to make an honest self-appraisal of whether you are adhering to or deviating from a given point. It can, I think, be very difficult to have an accurate idea of what "80%" omitting a particular food actually means with respect to one's progress - even just in your own mind as you assess how things are going. To me, this seems to go hand in hand with the natural tendency toward

Minimizing/Rationalizing the effect of certain behaviors and/or personal preferences, **especially in regard to certain foods**.

Thank you Mark for making this so much clearer and easier to understand. I thought I was being the most accurate with my %'s. Even trying to be the most honest. But now I see how the yes/no or did/didn't approach is a much better focus. I will definitely read over this again before the next weigh in. Thank you for always sharing these tips and tools. So grateful!

[Mark Cooper]

Question: why is a tablespoon of flax a day not recommended on this program?

From my perspective, chasing after individual nutrients (without a demonstrated need, based on evidence) is, at best, a distraction; at worst, actively counterproductive to what we seek to accomplish in this group - getting the food and our behaviors right from day to day on a consistent, ongoing basis.

Nutrients and the RDA/DRI
The RDA/DRI’s do not always apply to those following a healthy starch based diet. However by following the guidelines, especially starting meals with a soup or salad and the 50/50 guideline, one's diet with be very nutrient dense. In regard to weight, we do not recommend tracking your nutrients. Follow the plan, and the nutrients will be there.

While flax and walnuts may be a rich source of omega 3's, and some will recommended a certain amount, they are not really required at all as all plants have omega 3's and you are getting in plenty even if you don't consume any flax of walnuts.

1) My position on ALL supplements is that I do not recommend:

-the general and/or random use of any supplement

-supplements without informed consent. (All supplements have some risk)

-supplementation without a clearly established need that has been established in the context of a professional evaluation from a competent healthcare professional. All treatment is predicated upon proper diagnosis.

-supplementation that does not include the appropriate and continuing professional monitoring with a competent healthcare professional

-any supplement that is sold through an MLM company or from the healthcare professional recommending them.

2) In regard to general nutrition, I recommend the following:

-Undergo a complete nutritional evaluation of your diet to see if there are any nutrients that may be considered low.

-If there are any nutrients considered low, identify the healthiest foods that are highest in nutrient density for those nutrients and then adjust your diet to include more of these foods in your diet.

-Once done, re-evaluate your diet to make sure it is nutritionally adequate.

-You can do this with the help of a nutrition professional or you can do this yourself with one of the nutrition program available. My personal recommendation for this is the CRON-O-Meter, which is a free program and the nutrient search tool available at http://www.nutritiondata.com.

3)For those who have chosen to follow a diet completely free of all animal products, they have created a “need” for Vitamin B12 and so in this situation, a reliable source of Vitamin B12 is required and a supplement might be the way to fill that need.

4)In regard to the current focus on Vitamin D, if you are concerned or in the “at risk” category:

-Get yourself tested

-If you are deficient, then you need to speak with your healthcare adviser about how to raise your levels. You have several choices including sunshine, artificial UV light, supplements, prescription or a combination.

-Choose the option or combination of options you are most comfortable with and in 3 months, retest.

-If your numbers are now normal, you have the same options to choose from on how you will maintain your levels.

-If your numbers are still low, continue for 3 more months and then once again, re-evaluate your levels.

-The following groups are considered, "At risk”
- Breastfed infants
- Older adults
- People with limited sun exposure
- People with dark skin
- People with fat malabsorption
- People who are obese or who have undergone gastric bypass surgery

5)Lastly, in regard to the therapeutic use of supplements to treat specific health and medical conditions, yes, it is true that in some specific situations for some specific diseases, supplements may play a beneficial role. However, to see if this situation may apply specifically to you, please see my recommendations in point 1 above. Remember, all treatment is predicated upon proper diagnosis.

I think one of the advantages of MWL is that it has a clear, concise, easily-understandable set of guidelines (based on the best evidence) without much "wiggle room." Building in "exceptions" paves the way for still more "exceptions" - if THIS exception is OK, why not that - after all, a little (avocado, tofu, walnuts, peanut butter, toast, soy milk, coconut cream, popcorn, chocolate, wine, &c.) isn't likely to be a problem in small amounts, right?

People struggle to achieve their goals and when they take a close look at their diet, they see, there are too many foods that may be allowed but not ideal.

That is why many can't find success till they go on the MWL program (or some other stricter version of the program). The MWL is pretty black and white about what is allowed. There are no exceptions to it either. The regular program has a lot of gray area. And, for many, the little becomes a lot.

[wildgoose]

That is why many can't find success till they go on the MWL program (or some other stricter version of the program). The MWL is pretty black and white about what is allowed. There are no exceptions to it either. The regular program has a lot of gray area. And, for many, the little becomes a lot.

This is exactly what I found. However, I wasted years messing around with kinda-sorta-McDougall, kinda-sorta-MWL before I figured that out. I didn’t get the results I wanted, naturally. But I couldn’t give up my favorite (Pleasure Trap) foods. Even when I got rid of the worst offenders (finally!), I didn’t figure out that all my "justas" (just a little nut butter, just a little flax meal, just a few black olives or a couple of tortilla chips...) were adding up to make my overall diet way more calorie dense than it should be.

It didn’t help that I’m genetically on the curvy side, so I needed to have a diet lower in calorie density to get into the lower weight range where I wanted to be. All the while, I was pushing the envelope on the higher side of optimum calorie density — and wondering why I wasn’t losing the weight!

My suggestion to everybody who is trying to figure out a way to have their favorite "justa," or stretching the definitions on the checklist as far as they can...

Do the experiment. Commit to 60 days of solid adherence to the checklist. No exceptions. See where it gets you. Are you making slow but steady progress toward your goals? Are you finding that your cravings are mostly gone (hint: they will go away for the most part but only if you completely stop feeding them)? The fat cravings may take a little longer than 60 days to completely disappear, but cravings for sugar and salt go away sooner (if these are a problem for you and you are trying to limit them). With 60 days of good compliance, you should find this way of eating to be quite manageable. You may not even be asking yourself the "can I have ______?" (or "why can’t I have ________?") questions at that point, because it just won’t be that big of a deal.

If there are still things you’d like to reintroduce, know that there will come a time when you can try. When you’ve achieved your goals, you can try your highest priority "justas" and see how that works. You’ll figure out your own equilibrium. You might decide that having a few richer foods from the regular McDougall plan means you stabilize at 5 pounds heavier than you’d planned, and that might be OK. It’s up to you. But in the beginning stages, I urge you to give time and excellent adherence to the complete MWL checklist a try. Find out the answer without wasting a huge amount of time like I did.

The other thing that I did was spend way too much energy overthinking this. Complete adherence turned out to be much easier than trying to figure out what I could and couldn’t have. I’d also recommend that you read all of Jeff's comments that Mark quoted above. You won’t be too low in Omega-3s without nuts, seeds, or flax meal. You don’t need supplements (other than B12) unless a test shows a deficiency, and even then, many deficiencies can be corrected without resorting to supplements. Eat a variety of MWL food, get some sunshine and some exercise, get enough sleep. Relax and focus on the process. The rest will take care of itself.

Goose

[Aprincess]

Wild goose, Thank you! I just popped in here for the first time in a lonnngggg time and I found your post so spot on for me. Thank you for all the reminders.

[josietheschnauzer]

May I add a big, AMEN, to the comments by Mark and Wild Goose, and again applaud Jeff and his succinct comments! And, speaking of Jeff Novick: For those of you who spend money on magazines (smile, me), the latest Forks over Knives, Winter 2021, quotes Jeff on page 25! The magazine is reviewing the new food label and quotes Jeff on sodium. Yea!

Also, for Jeff, I hope this isn't a totally stupid question relating to sodium. Sadly, everything I pick up that is canned is way over the top: Canned artichokes are an example. Sometimes I can't find the sodium free frozen ones. Is there a way to reduce the "sodium density" of a canned product like we can reduce the calorie density of a dish when we add more vegetables?

Thank you all. I can't believe that we are at the last weigh in for January! I can't believe I am making it through December and January not going off the deep end of pleasure trapping!!! Cheers and all that!

[Aprincess]

I can't believe I am making it through December and January not going off the deep end of pleasure trapping!!! Cheers and all that!

Congratulations! I wish I would have come back sooner. I went way off plan with chocolate, sugar and flour. But! Onward and downward!

[JeffN]

Also, for Jeff, I hope this isn't a totally stupid question relating to sodium. Sadly, everything I pick up that is canned is way over the top: Canned artichokes are an example. Sometimes I can't find the sodium free frozen ones. Is there a way to reduce the "sodium density" of a canned product like we can reduce the calorie density of a dish when we add more vegetables?

Two of the principles of toxicology are 1) The dose is the poison. 2) Dilution is the solution

I do not know where you are but having lived and traveled to many places, I am always amazed at the no salt added and low sodium products available. I am buying most of mine right now from Publix, Aldi’s, Target, and vitacost and am able to get virtually everything or anything I want, no or low sodium.

If you rinse, soak and drain the product, you can reduce the sodium, depending on what products it is, up to about 30%. This may not have a huge impact of full salt products.

Yes, technically you could dilute the sodium with other foods that have no added salt, but again, the impact depends on the amount of sodium you are trying to dilute. (The original “dose”). If a can of something has 750 mg per serving and you are using 2 servings, diluted or not, thats the number we are trying to stay under for the day. It would also take pounds of vegetables to dilute that.

So, it is possible, depends on the product and the amount of salt, and I would double check what is available. Some items are low or now sodium and don’t say so on their label, (ie, many important tomato products)

Hope this helps
Jeff