Clarification about MWL guidelines....

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Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby Dragonflyrider » Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:35 pm

Jeff et all.....
Could you please clarify several questions about the MWL plan, and changes between the original MWL book, the several pages in the Starch Solution book, and the 10 point MWL article?
1) Whole wheat pasta is allowed, but are any other grains/legumes, such as chickpea, lentil or brown rice pasta?
2) Small amts of sugar are allowed in the original book and the 10 point article, but the SS says to eliminate... can you please clarify whether small amts of sugar are allowed, as well as maple syrup for flavoring oatmeal?
3) A recent email with MWL recipes came out which allows cornstarch for thickening, so would brown rice flour also be allowed to thicken gravies?

I and a few other's would greatly appreciate your input to these questions for moderating a MWL group. Thank you!
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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JeffN » Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:51 am

>>>>1) Whole wheat pasta is allowed, but are any other grains/legumes, such as chickpea, lentil or brown rice pasta?

They are allowed but there is no real benefit to them over the whole grain pasta in the context of our dietary pattern. Also, remember, legumes are limited (in any form) and these legume based products can be 2-3x the cost, or more. The health concerns we have our not because we are eating whole grain pasta instead of legume pasta.


>>>>2) Small amts of sugar are allowed in the original book and the 10 point article, but the SS says to eliminate... can you please clarify whether small amts of sugar are allowed, as well as maple syrup for flavoring oatmeal?

Yes.

Can you please provide the quote (with page number) in TSS where you see to eliminate sugar.

>>>>3) A recent email with MWL recipes came out which allows cornstarch for thickening, so would brown rice flour also be allowed to thicken gravies?

I would not recommend either for MWL. They only increase Calorie Density and the Passive Over Consumption of Calories (which is what those following MWL are trying to avoid). There are many whole food thickeners ie., potato.

>>>>I and a few other's would greatly appreciate your input to these questions for moderating a MWL group. Thank you![/quote]

I recommend those who want to participate in a moderated MWL group to take part in the official one here at these DB’s so they don’t run into these issues and can get a quick official answer to any concern.

In health
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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JOJO1947 » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:25 pm

Pg 192-3 The Starch Solution

“If you seek to accelerate your weight loss, or if you suffer from a chronic disease or are on the cusp of developing one, I recommend AVOIDING THESE FOODS ALTOGETHER. If, on the other hand, you are already happy with your weight or not in a hurry to lose, and you do not suffer from a chronic illness, you might wish to consider including SMALL quantities of these higher calorie foods in your starch based meals. AVOCADOS, DRIED FRUITS, FLOURS (whole grain, white, all-purpose), FRUIT AND VEGETABLE JUICES, NUTS, PEANUTS AND PEANUT BUTTER, SEEDS, SIMPLE SUGARS (table sugar, maple syrup, molasses, agave).”

Because pasta when cooked is lower in calorie density, is that an exception to the 'no flour' advice?

Also Achieving Maximum Weight Loss. From The Starch Solution Pg 216

"Avoid all simple sugars, including dried fruits and juices."

JoAnn
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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JeffN » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:38 pm

Thanks for the quote on the sugar.

In regard to the simple sugars, we allow them in small quantities on the MWL program, sprinkled at the table on the food to maximize taste. And we say, if they are a problem for you, you can eliminate them. Most people find out they are not a problem when sprinkled on the food at the table to taste. The problem is the excess and especially when are part of high fat, high calorie dense ultra processed foods.

And yes, dried fruits and juices are avoided but not because they are simple sugars but because dried fruits are calorie dense and fruit juices and juice concentrates are liquid calories and are counted as "added sugars" these days by many health organizations.

Yes, pasta is allowed because it is lower in calorie density once cooked with water. It is also why we do not recommend flour tortillas as they are higher in calorie density.

I am not sure the purpose of the other quote however, we do not recommend modifications and tweaks to accelerate weight loss. We need to learn how to eat each day, day in and day out, for the rest of our lives. As in Doug's lecture, be the tortoise, not the hare.

The problem with the rich food and high fat foods is the are the epitome of what to avoid, high fat and high calorie dense and the leading contributor to the passive over consumption of calories. The key is passive. People aren't trying to do it or know it is happening.

Remember, all of these things are only guidelines, not black and white rules, The more you do, the better your results.

All of this is laid out in the MWL forum and the MWL Weigh In, for several years now. I would encourage anyone who is having trouble with weight or the MWL guidelines to join the MWL weigh-in as I consider Mark to be one of the best moderators we have had for MWL and that I have seen.

In Health
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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JOJO1947 » Sat Jul 02, 2022 5:55 am

Jeff, a question about the 50-50 plate in MWL............. Would you recommend it and when? Thanks! JoAnn
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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JeffN » Sat Jul 02, 2022 6:02 am

JOJO1947 wrote:Jeff, a question about the 50-50 plate in MWL............. Would you recommend it and when? Thanks! JoAnn



Hmmm…. What’s the question and the context?
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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JOJO1947 » Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:48 am

Jeff, the reason I asked about the 50-50 plate is related to

A 10-POINT CHECKLIST FOR MAXIMUM WEIGHT LOSS (MWL) On the McDougall Discussion Boards January 2021

1) Start each meal with a soup and/or salad and/or fruit.
2) Follow the 50/50 plate method for your meals, filling half your plate (by visual volume) with non-starchy vegetables and 50% (by visual volume) with minimally processed starches. Choose fruit for dessert.

I think those were the most recent guidelines I saw for MWL. So does McDougall recommend starting with that 50-50 plate?

Thanks JoAnn
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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JeffN » Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:15 am

JOJO1947 wrote:Jeff, the reason I asked about the 50-50 plate is related to

A 10-POINT CHECKLIST FOR MAXIMUM WEIGHT LOSS (MWL) On the McDougall Discussion Boards January 2021

1) Start each meal with a soup and/or salad and/or fruit.
2) Follow the 50/50 plate method for your meals, filling half your plate (by visual volume) with non-starchy vegetables and 50% (by visual volume) with minimally processed starches. Choose fruit for dessert.

I think those were the most recent guidelines I saw for MWL. So does McDougall recommend starting with that 50-50 plate?

Thanks JoAnn


I still am not sure I understand the question. :)

The 10 points recommend “starting” with a soup and/or salad and/or fruit. I do not see anything that implies starting with the 50/50 plate method. If you are seeing something I am not, let me know.

The 50/50 plate method is also a guideline and the “method” means “up to” 50% non starchy veggies and/or fruit”. It’s not a black and white rule that the plate be 50/50, It might be 25/75 or 33/67 or 40/60 (non starchy veggies and/or fruit/starch).

Everyone has to find their “sweet spot,” which may be the most important concept, and is a combination of weight, volume, calorie density, satiety, fiber/cal etc.

These are all guidelines to help people find their sweet spot.

Make sense?

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Re: Clarification about MWL guidelines....

Postby JOJO1947 » Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:43 pm

Thanks Jeff. Your reply is crystal clear! Much appreciated. I also asked Mark on the MWL forum as I didn't realize you had answered me. There is no longer an option to have an email alert that you have answered. Have a great day!
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