rheumatoid arthritis vegan

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rheumatoid arthritis vegan

Postby bmengel » Tue Nov 28, 2006 3:43 pm

I have been eating a wholefoods vegan diet for over 2 years yet I started to get symptoms for what my doctor thinks is rheumatoid arthritis. I will find out, but in the meantime - I wake up and my hands ache - I have to move them for awhile, then they feel better. Is it possible that I am eating something that is doing this? Or maybe I am not eating something that I should. I take supplements because I have a small appetite and know that some days I just don't get enough food in to get what I need. I am female, 5'5", 115 pounds, 44 years old. I also drink at least 3 cups of green tea a day. One of the supplements I take is: Protective Breast Formula (http://www.protectivebreast.com/go/prot ... eastHealth) because my sister had breast cancer and I was misdiagnosed with it at one point. Could it be the formula causing a problem?

Also, I do not rely on seitan and soy products to get my protein. I eat lots of beans, though I do eat seitan and tempeh once in a while.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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Postby hope101 » Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:13 pm

I had a look at the supplement and don't personally see anything really objectionable, but I suspect Dr. McDougall would recommend you don't take anything other than a low fat vegan diet. Is your diet low fat as well? Are you excellent at eating broccoli, kale, cauliflower, etc? You might want to consider e-mailing Dr. McDougall re the supplement.
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Some vegan things can cause auto-immune responses....

Postby S B » Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:45 pm

Some people have a problem with gluten which can trigger an auto-immune response in a few people. See Dr. McDougall's newsletter article "Could it be Celiac Disease?” at http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2005nl/sept/050900.htm

Some people are sensitive to one or more of the substances in the various nightshade vegetables (potatoes, tomatoes, eggplant, peppers, etc.). However, I do not think the reactions to nightshades are auto-immune in nature. I believe (though I could be wrong) that these chemicals somehow simply interfere with some chemicals in our muscles and simply make us a little stiff and sore and are NOT life threatening -- unless consumed in extremely large amounts.

When I stopped consuming dairy, virtually all of my severe arthritis-like pains (and sinus problems) went away. However, at times I still had a little minor pain and stiffness in my fingers and toes. I tried the elimination diet and narrowed down my minor pains to Irish potatoes -- mainly the part just underneath the skin.

I still eat potatoes, but I make doubly sure that I trim away anything that is green or even remotely green on and just below the peelings.

The elimination diet is described on Dr. McDougall's site at http://drmcdougall.com/med_allergic.html

Hope this helps!
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P.S.

Postby S B » Tue Nov 28, 2006 4:49 pm

P.S. Three cups of green tea a day is a lot of caffeine! Dr. McDougall says a little green tea, now and then, is OK for most people but that we should not overdo caffeine. I usually drink green tea about once a week -- as as special treat.
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Postby Rich Richardson » Tue Nov 28, 2006 6:14 pm

You might want to reduce your consumption of sodium.
I find that even small amounts of sodium cause the conditions you describe.

As an experiment you could go on a diet of just potatoes , and distilled water.

The sodium content in potatoes is very low. No sodium in Distilled water.

If sodium is the cause, your discomfort should go away in just a few days.

There is still the issue of the green tea, If the discomfort goes away , you
could go back to drinking the tea and see if that causes a problem.

I no longer drink tea or coffee, but is seems like it was a problem as well.

Prior to reducing my sodium intake I could not close my hands.


My daily intake of sodium is less than 500 mg a day. Anytime I go over that, I get pain and discomfort.

Hope this helps you,

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Re: P.S.

Postby LJ » Wed Nov 29, 2006 5:47 am

S B wrote:P.S. Three cups of green tea a day is a lot of caffeine! Dr. McDougall says a little green tea, now and then, is OK for most people but that we should not overdo caffeine. I usually drink green tea about once a week -- as as special treat.


I drink decaffeinated green tea all the time.
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White sugar, diet sodas, and sometimes...

Postby Clary » Wed Nov 29, 2006 7:57 am

white potatoes can trigger my arthritis symptoms.
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elimination diet question

Postby bmengel » Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:09 am

Thank you for all your responses.

I am going to do the elimination diet. I am also going to cut out all tea and lower my salt - though I don't use much salt I will try to bring it further down.


Dr. McDougall does not list any beans on this diet. Do you think I can eat lentils and adzuki beans? Also, do you think quiona is alright?


I am emailing Dr. McDougall with these questions but was wondering if anyone knew.

BTW- My diet is low fat.

Thanks again,
Bonita
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Acceptable foods on the elim diet

Postby Burgess » Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:52 am

I am not a physician or scientist. My experiences may not be applicable to anyone else.

bmengel wrote:I am also going to cut out all tea and lower my salt - though I don't use much salt I will try to bring it further down.

If my memory still serves me, the only drink allowed on the elimination diet is water; and salt is the only flavoring allowed on the elimination diet. If you are also cutting down on salt, be sure to examine the salt content of any prepared foods, especially Asian ones. You probably won't be eating any prepared foods on the elimination diet.

Suggestion: The elim diet is very tough for most people. Don't worry about cutting down on salt until after you have tried the ED for a couple of weeks or more. Salt makes it acceptable. If the ED doesn't help you by reducing your arthritis symptoms, then try cutting out salt completely. That is the true way to test things. It won't be pleasant, but you will have more confidence in the test results.

Dr. McDougall does not list any beans on this diet. Do you think I can eat lentils and adzuki beans?

Doublecheck the list and follow it exactly. My memory tells me that the only bean or pea allowed is green beans. Eat no others. Nearly all beans are acid-producing, and thus, I think, suspects as causes for -itis problems.

By the way, you do not need to eat beans or peas to get plenty of protein. You can get all the protein you need from a wide variety of fruit, vegetables, and rice (for example).

Also, do you think quiona is alright?

Do you mean the grain, quinoa? If so, the answer is, as far as I can remember, no, you shouldn't eat any grain except rice on the ED. But doublecheck the list yourself.

Personally, based on my experience, I would drop the brown rice from the elimination diet, and either substitute white rice or eat no rice at all.

My experience, based only on my particular needs (which may not apply to anyone else) is that any food which is acid-producing is a possible source of -itis problems. However, of all the grains, white rice is the least acid-producing. I describe my personal experiences here: www.aristotleadventure.com/anti-itis and that site includes a link to a table of foods based on Potential Renal Acid Load.

BTW- My diet is low fat.

That is good. Many vegans have terrible diets. Is your diet also low protein? Too much protein might be contributing to arthritis problems.
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Wondering

Postby bmengel » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:08 am

How does exercise play into this plan?
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Postby Burgess » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:52 am

bmengel wrote:How does exercise play into this plan?

To which plan are you referring?

My particular health plan includes daily, varied exercise: posture-correcting exercises, stretching exercises, strenghtening exercises, and aerobic (cardiovascular) exercises.

Diet alone, I have found, isn't enough to achieve full health. Exercise is necessary too.
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Re: elimination diet question

Postby Clary » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:54 am

bmengel wrote:
Dr. McDougall does not list any beans on this diet. Do you think I can eat lentils and adzuki beans?

Bonita


Go here:
http://drmcdougall.com/free_4b.html

and scroll down to LEGUMES for lists of McDougall "approved" beans, lentils, peas, etc.
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Re: elimination diet question

Postby Burgess » Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:31 pm

Clary wrote:Go here:
http://drmcdougall.com/free_4b.html

and scroll down to LEGUMES for lists of McDougall "approved" beans, lentils, peas, etc.

Clary, is that list suitable for the elimination diet? So far as I can tell, none of them, except green ("string") beans, are listed at ...

http://drmcdougall.com/med_allergic.html

... about half way down, under "My Recommendations."
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My apologies...

Postby Clary » Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:51 pm

[quote="Burgess ] Clary, is that list suitable for the elimination diet? So far as I can tell, none of them, except green ("string") beans, are listed at ...

[quote]

I apologize. I responded in relation to the regular McDougall program, not an elimination program, still thinking in terms of the original post in this thread. I am not knowledgeable about the elimination diet approved foods.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention.
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