Burgess - did you challenge with white rice?

[Anne]

Burgess - I think you said that you were going to try a white rice challenge to see if there was one grain you could tolerate. How did that go?

[Burgess]

I am not sure what you mean by "challenge," but, yes, I did use the standard, post-Elimination Diet test: 1 serving (half cup dry) of white rice per meal for six meals (two days) in a row.

Great news for me: I got no reaction at all. I went even further this week, by eating white rice at every meal for five days in a row -- and I still got no reaction.

A third experiment I did, a couple of weeks ago, was to add about 1 teaspoon of oat bran to my meals. I definitely did get an adverse reaction in my skin (which is my "litmus paper"). So, at least for oats, the bran might be the acidifier (if acidity is the cause of the skin problem). I assume that is true for rice bran and wheat bran, but I have not tested them.

White rice, according the PRAL list published on John Berardi's site, is by far the least acid-producing of all the grains. (Brown rice is much more acidifying, but that isn't a problem for most people.)

Being able to eat white rice is a great boon for me:
- Now I can eat at Asian restaurants without fuss.
- White rice is cheap and easy to transport (I walk 1.5 miles to the store).
- It is easy to prepare and store.

So now my starches are: white rice; roots (potatoes, rutabagas, sweet potatoes), and gourds (pumpkin and other winter squashes).

Thanks for asking.

[chewy]

what great news about the white rice agreeing with you! I have tried to eat oats recently and I noticed that my skin felt itchy afterwards. I never get any sort of reaction eating rice.I will stick to rice -gluten-free is for me!
Happy Mcdougalling to you!
Chewy

[Anne]

Thanks, Burgess, for your always helpful information. I particularly wanted to know because I want to try the elimination diet with the PRAL ratings in mind, but regular potatoes are a suspect food for me. I made a short attempt at it this week, but couldn't bear to look at another squash. White rice would be doable. Not a perfect test, but it might at least let me test potatoes.

My skin is my litmus test as well - only I have psoriasis. It reacts within 24 hours to dairy and beef and I'm hoping it will be that helpful in detecting other problem foods.

Thanks again, and I'm glad you have such a good flexible addition to your starch selection!

[Burgess]

[...] I want to try the elimination diet with the PRAL ratings in mind, but regular potatoes are a suspect food for me.

I am not sure what you mean. I think you are saying you want to follow the Elimination Diet (described here http://www.drmcdougall.com/med_allergic.html about half-way down) for awhile, and then if you see improvement on the Elim Diet, you will test potatoes using the standard re-introduction test. Have I understood correctly?

Two more points: (1) So far as I can tell, Dr. McDougall's Elimination Diet is completely alkaline-producing except for the two brown rice entries in the starch section. White rice is just barely acidifying, according to the PRAL list on John Berardi's site. My understanding is that for most people, brown rice is a better choice for the long-term diet, but for the very short-term Elim Diet, substituting white rice might be better for anyone who -- as a rare condition -- suspects PRAL might be a factor in inflammation problems.

(2) Just to make sure we are talking about the same thing, I should mention to other readers that "white" potatoes (Idaho, Russet, Yukon, Red, etc.) are not on the Elim Diet. They are a forbidden food for the duration of the ED.

I made a short attempt at it this week, but couldn't bear to look at another squash.

You might try pumpkin, yams, sweet potatoes, parsnips, and rutabagas as starches (which means, as a way to fill up for a few hours!). Another possibility is tapioca (cassava) but I have never figured out a way to prepare it in a manner that is at all appealing. (Note too that tapioca has almost no fiber, which means there is a need to add high-fiber vegs or lax fruit.)

Anne, I found that drinking nothing but water was hard (but doable) at first. Almost as hard as using no flavorings except salt. Have you found that to be difficult too? The reward however is that after doing the Elim Diet for awhile, almost anything else tastes great once you get to expand your diet again.

[Anne]

Sorry, I've been studying for exams, and at 47 years, that fries my brain.

Yes, I tried the elimination diet, just eating squash, sweet potatoes, green beans, and cooked cherries. I'm not sure I can face it with just squash and sweet potatoes as my starch source. White rice would make me happy.

I forgot that potatoes aren't allowed since I knew that they couldn't be allowed for me. I will be testing them with the re-introduction test.

As far as water goes, drinking water as my only liquid is a natural habit for me. No problem there.

The flavoring issues are hard. I don't use salt because my bp is salt-sensitive. I'm accustomed to using a lot of Mediterranean spices - thyme, marjoram, basil, rosemary, etc. The biggest problem is that I normally season my squash with curry sauce or hot sauce.

I think I will try again with white rice as my starch and do brown rice as a re-introduction food later in the process. I like rice and steamed vegetables as a meal and it should be easy to re-introduce one vegetable at a time that way.

This is surprisingly difficult, but I think it will give me some real answers.

[Burgess]

The flavoring issues are hard. [...]

This is surprisingly difficult, but I think it will give me some real answers.

The Elimination Diet, if followed long enough and without making exceptions, can be very informative indeed.

Here is a suggestion that worked for me: Make the first thing you re-introduce (with the standard re-intro test) either a flavorizing food (such as tomatoes) or your favorite non-seed-based flavoring (such as basil).

What I mean by "flavorizing food" is a food which adds (or masks other) flavors. Tomatoes, for me, do that job very well. You might have other favorites you can test. Something simple like lemon juice can add a lot of flavor to vegs -- and at the same time give you a chance to test citrus fruit, I suppose.

[Malva]

Great to hear that you're doing so well, Burgess.

For me, I've come to love squash so much, and eat only small amounts of rice (1/2 cooked a day). The small amount of sprouted brown rice seems to be agreeable with my skin.
(White rice makes my intestines come to a stand-still, so I can only eat fiberous foods.)
I had the flu a few weeks ago, and was unable to eat anything for 24 hours. My skin was completely clear. Which was a eye-opening epiphany for my husband. He now is far more understanding of the way foods affect my skin, and is much more supportive.

[Burgess]

(White rice makes my intestines come to a stand-still, so I can only eat fiberous foods.)

First, Malva, congratulations on making progress against your skin inflammation problem -- and on acquiring more knowledge about the diet that is right for you.

I solve the low fiber problem with white rice by making sauces to put over the rice and vegetables after they are steamed. Two examples:

1. Okra and tomatoes. (Okra is moderately high in fiber, but like prunes it also seems to have a lax effect that goes beyond the fiber.)

2. Pumpkin sauce: canned pumpkin with garlic, onions, lemon juice. Pumpkin is very high in fiber compared to most vegetables, but not, of course, as much as beans and peas, which are unfortunately forbidden on my diet [ http://www.aristotleadventure.com/anti-itis/ ]. Still it works very well.

Other possibilities include eating other lax fruit with the meal: prunes, chopped and spread over the rice and vegs, or berries, such as blackberries.

[Anne]

One the intriguing things I come across in looking for psoriasis and diet links is that psoriatics who were very short of food in Europe during the WWII experienced clearing skin. I know you don't have psoriasis, but your comment about not eating for 24 hours and having clear skin caught my eye.

I'm putting off my elimination diet until January since my skin is so stress-responsive that it will mask diet results. I have eliminated beans and switched to white rice in the interim as a sort of head start. Fortunately, no food on earth has the power to constipate me

Burgess, I'm going to have to try that pumpkin sauce. I do like pumpkin, squash and sweet potatoes a lot when they aren't my only starch.

Thank you both for your encouraging stories.

[Burgess]

Based on my experience, I don't recommend fasting, except for specific medical purposes (like, before blood work, I suppose). My experience is that the body functions best on a steady schedule of moderate eating.

However, I would like to point out that not eating or drinking anything but water (which is what fasting is) is the ultimate form of elimination diet.

If a problem goes away when you fast, then I would think you can be reasonably sure that some class of food you were eating before was causing the problems. Then all you would need to do is, following Dr. McDougall's re-introduction procedure, add one food back per week, to see the results.

Unfortunately, that process is too slow. So, for most people, starting from the elim diet, as a base, makes a lot more sense.