Ankylosing Spondylitis?

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Ankylosing Spondylitis?

Postby boardn10 » Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:02 pm

Hi!!!

Has anyone else on this board been diagnosed with AS? I have in recent years and decided to finally get strict about my diet. I was a semi vegetarian in the past but now I am trying the McDougall diet once I receive his book. Right now I am Vegan.

Anyone?

Rich
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Re: Ankylosing Spondylitis?

Postby Clary » Fri Sep 21, 2007 6:36 pm

boardn10 wrote:Hi!!!

..but now I am trying the McDougall diet once I receive his book.


If you care to go ahead and get started, the McDougall's offer their "Free Program" on the main website:

http://drmcdougall.com/free.html

The board is sometimes slower on Friday and the week-end.

Welcome. Keep comin' back.
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Postby boardn10 » Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:59 pm

I am so confused becaus eon the kickAS.org site they speak of the no starch diet where you eat no grains, potatoes, etc. However, you eat meat, and other animal proteins, fruit, veggetables, etc.

Question - I can do everything on that list with the exception of coffee. I am a coffee nut and am looking to start my own business which involves cupping, roasting, etc. Basically I am deep in coffee. I also roast my own. This is my only pitfall. :-(
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Postby Autumn » Sat Sep 22, 2007 9:39 pm

Im not familiar with this disease. I would email dr. mcdougall and see what his feelings are on it.
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Similar to Rheumatoid Arthritis

Postby dagnabit » Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:16 pm

If I remember correctly, AS is similar to Rheumatoid Arthritis. My Dad (70) has had symptoms that look alot like AS for the past two years -- tremendous pain in his joints that kept moving around his body. The pain was so bad that he could hardly function. He started taking high doses of vitamin C for a few months at the end of last year, which seemed to help with inflammation and allowed him to get off Prednisone. In January of this year he had a hernia operation that wouldn't heal and had to take high doses of antibiotics for several weeks to fight infection. At the same time he went on a plant-based diet and has continued it until now. Interestingly, all symptoms disappeared after the antibiotics. He has been pain-free and drug free since the end of January. He is convinced that the antibiotics took care of the problem and the new diet is keeping it from returning. There is a night and day difference between how he was and how he is today!
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Postby daniellechef » Mon Sep 24, 2007 11:46 pm

I have AS. It is a mild form of it, women don't usually get it as bad as men do. I also have Scleroderma. I have found this diet to be a life saver. The first night I tried this diet was the first night I was able to sleep through the night without waking up from back pain. I still get pain, but not remotely as severe. I have found dairy especially aggravates it. Dairy is hidden in so many things too, it can be frustrating.
I have been doing McDougall for over a year now. It is natural for me and my family now.
I hardly notice my autoimmune disorders now. Good luck with it! I hope it works as well for you.
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Postby daniellechef » Mon Sep 24, 2007 11:48 pm

Oh yeah....I work for a coffee roasting company. I still drink it.
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Postby marybeth0051 » Tue Sep 25, 2007 11:21 pm

Rich,
Yes, my husband has it....he has had pain since his 20's, now 51, and has suffered with back, hip, shoulder and knee pain for years! After his back surgery 1 1/2 years ago, I put him on a vegan diet...(since he was flat on his back and had no control over what he ate) ...and within a very short time he was totally pain free...no more hip, knee, or back pain at all. He still remains pain free and is amazed! He is now a believer in the vegan diet and it's effects on chronic diseases.
"Let food be your medicine and medicine be your food" Hippocrates
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Postby boardn10 » Tue Oct 02, 2007 9:43 pm

I wish I could have the same luck.

Most research shows to avoid all starchs such as breads, potatoes, peanuts, beans, etc. As a veggan that left me little to eat other than fruit and veggies.

I ended up having to either go back to a more standard balanced diet or no starches.

17 studies from around the world have shown tarches to feed the desease, so to speak.
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Proof that starches cause AS?

Postby Burgess » Wed Oct 03, 2007 6:35 am

boardn10 wrote:17 studies from around the world have shown tarches to feed the desease, so to speak.

Which of the 17 studies would you consider the best, that is, the most objective, the most rigorously scientific? Perhaps we can focus on that one and see how strong the supposed proof is that starches cause AS.

My own personal experience with a wide range of inflammation problems (but not AS) confirms that some of the starches you named -- grains (bread), legumes, and peanuts -- do indeed cause inflammation problems for me. (I have "leaky-gut syndrome," and I avoid all acid-producing foods, as explained here: http://www.aristotleadventure.com/anti-itis/

My experience, confirmed by the PRAL list, is that seeds of nearly all kinds, as well as all animal products except fats, are acid-producing and the cause of inflammation problems in me. Starches from roots (such as potatoes and sweet potatoes) are benign, in my experience.

P. S. -- Do you have perfect posture? If not, have you considered daily posture-correction exercises to relieve some of the stress on the vertebrae?
Burgess Laughlin, Star McDougaller
My books: http://www.reasonversusmysticism.com
My health weblog: http://anti-itisdiet.blogspot.com
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Postby groundhogg » Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:20 am

Just some thoughts on this...I've read a little bit about AS, and I believe it is classified as autoimmune and one of the rheumatological diseases, although different in ways...still, that like many of those diseases, and like just about all autoimmune diseases, it can also affect eyes, lungs, various organs, and may possibly also originate from leaky gut syndrome.

As I understand leaky gut syndrome, the openings in the small intestine that are supposed to let digested nutrients into the bloodstream become too large, and at the same time, it's possible some proteins are not adequately broken down, enter into the bloodstream and are attacked by the immune system. I have read that a hormone called zonulin is responsible for the size of the openings in our intestine...that too much zonulin causes the openings to become too wide, thus allowing undigested protein fragments to escape and activate the immune system.

I've also read that gluten, in all people--even those who are not gluten intolerant--plays a role in the amounts of zonulin secreted...in my mind, I imagine this to be something like how glucose stimulates our production of insulin...that gluten (and I guess other foods do it too, but gluten is the only one I've seen written in regard to zonulin production) causes the spikes in zonulin that could be responsible for a part of this cascade of health events. I've read that in the absence of gluten among people with autoimmune disorders, the leaky gut part might get better, and there may be hope for arresting or even reversving the disorder if other factors come into place right.

I would think one of the other factors needing to come into place would be withdrawal of casein and other dairy proteins, especially those from pasteurized cow's milk (and unpasteurized may be safer autoimmune-wise, but could cause deadly infectious diseases)...from what I've heard, milk from other animals...such as goats, has much less or in some types of goats no casein, although there would be other proteins that could still cause trouble in those sensitive to them.

As far as avoiding starches across the board...yes, there are studies. I can't remember the name of the bacterium now, but in many autoimmune diseases there is a specific bacterium to be found present...and I remember reading of one in particular associated with AS, although it isn't clear how that bacterium is involved...still, it's one that does feed on starches in general...from what I've read, studies are not entirely clear on that, but apparently some people find relief by avoiding all starches...so...there has been research involved in that.

After I discovered my problems with gluten, I became really curious about all of these sorts of things and started doing some reading...eventually runnning across an interesting, thought-provoking web site by a veterinarian, John Symes, in Mobile Alabama. Going by the name Dogtor J on the net...he writes of his similar problems with gluten sensitivity, and then sort of cross-referencing things in his veterinary studies/practice and did tons of research and came up with some interesting stuff... his site is interesting, for sure, www.dogtorj.net even if you might not automatically agree with everything he says, still he puts out plenty for thought on there. In a nutshell...he has come to believe that there are four foods that can instigate leaky gut syndrome, which will then potentially go on to produce autoimmune diseases...the four foods are casein (anything at all dairy), gluten, soy, and corn. He points out that traditionally, these foods were included in people's diets only after some method of "digestion" outside of the body was engaged...such as fermentation, etc. He believes that simple-stomached animals, including dogs/cats and humans, simply cannot properly digest these foods.

Dogtor J really caught my attention when he said that he believed that celiacs who don't improve well after removing all gluten from their diets seem to get much better once they removed the other 3 potential offenders.

He also believes that he has seen evidence in his dogs/cats-patients, and people he's talked to, that other sensitivites that came about during the leaky gut episode may eventually become tolerated if the 4 foods above are completed avoided long enough.

So...that's all I know about it. I think some people we've seen here do make dramatic improvements in autoimmune disorders by going vegan, getting the casein out of their diets, but for others, I think some of the proteins in other foods may cause as much trouble. THe starches, if there is a particular bacterium involved that you're feeding with starches....then, of course, you would want to avoid that...maybe not forever, if everything else fell into place to set your body up for healing...but at least for a few years.

Just my opinion...for whatever it's worth.
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Re: Proof that starches cause AS?

Postby Burgess » Thu Oct 04, 2007 2:28 pm

boardn10, a couple of days ago I asked:
Burgess wrote:
boardn10 wrote:17 studies from around the world have shown tarches to feed the desease, so to speak.

Which of the 17 studies would you consider the best, that is, the most objective, the most rigorously scientific? Perhaps we can focus on that one and see how strong the supposed proof is that starches cause AS.


Could you provide an answer? It would be very helpful to see such a study, even just one of the 17 you say have been conducted.
Burgess Laughlin, Star McDougaller
My books: http://www.reasonversusmysticism.com
My health weblog: http://anti-itisdiet.blogspot.com
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Postby Yoga Nurse » Sat Oct 06, 2007 11:31 am

Eating the McDougall diet has CURED my rheumatoid arthritis. As long as I stay on the diet, eat no fat and stay very low on sodium I have no pain at all. The studies that I've read all agree that this is the way to go. I have in fact reversed some of the joint damage that occurred prior to my complete change over to the McDougall diet. I'm healthy, work a full time job (I'm an RN) and run my own yoga studio teaching several classes each week. All this has been confirmed by my rheumatologist who has never seen anything like it. He was, quite simply, amazed.

I know other people with autoimmune disorders who have tried various "natural approaches" dietary, herbs, or supplements, and over time I see them become more and more ill. It's sad because they don't have to suffer this way. There is hope and there is help. And you can do it yourself without exposing yourself to harmful foods, drugs or anything.

Anna
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Re: Proof that starches cause AS?

Postby boardn10 » Wed Dec 12, 2007 4:07 pm

Burgess wrote:boardn10, a couple of days ago I asked:
Burgess wrote:
boardn10 wrote:17 studies from around the world have shown tarches to feed the desease, so to speak.

Which of the 17 studies would you consider the best, that is, the most objective, the most rigorously scientific? Perhaps we can focus on that one and see how strong the supposed proof is that starches cause AS.


Could you provide an answer? It would be very helpful to see such a study, even just one of the 17 you say have been conducted.


I'll try to find more documentation on the studies. I have some of it in book form but let me search the net. So, you have inflammation issues? I only have some aches in my mid back but I get pins and needles in my feet and aches in my ankles and knees. I am trying to do a gluten free but wonder if it is worth the effort......it isn't easy, LOL. Gluten is in everything. Plus, we leave for vacation this weekend. Eating is going to be tough.

Heck, the AS No Starch diet would be easier. LOL.

Maybe I'll try to get more stricyt on the McDougall diet with no nuts and seeds. With no gluten, I can't have any sandwiches because rice bread is horrible. It is only good with nut butters but we all know about those!

After vacation...I am going to try the McDougall elimination diet. Is that the diet he lists in a news letter?
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Postby momof4 » Wed Dec 12, 2007 8:03 pm

boardn10--I watched Dr Klaper's presentation yesterday on the Hawaiian veg site. Have you been checked for B12?
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